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When a Disciplinary Council May Be Necessary: Serious Transgression “It includes (but is not limited to) attempted murder, forcible rape, sexual abuse, spouse abuse, intentional serious physical injury of others, adultery, fornication, homosexual relations (especially sexual cohabitation) ...” - Policies on Ordinances for Children of a Parent Living in a Same-Gender Relationship, Updates to Handbook 1, November 3, 2015. "Additions to Handbook 1 have been approved by the Council of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles for immediate implementation." The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints | wasmormon.org
When a Disciplinary Council May Be Necessary: Serious Transgression “It includes (but is not limited to) attempted murder, forcible rape, sexual abuse, spouse abuse, intentional serious physical injury of others, adultery, fornication, homosexual relations (especially sexual cohabitation) ...” - Policies on Ordinances for Children of a Parent Living in a Same-Gender Relationship, Updates to Handbook 1, November 3, 2015. "Additions to Handbook 1 have been approved by the Council of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles for immediate implementation." The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
When a Disciplinary Council is Mandatory: Apostasy “As used here, apostasy refers to members who: Are in a same-gender marriage.” Policies on Ordinances for Children of a Parent Living in a Same-Gender Relationship, Updates to Handbook 1, November 3, 2015. "Additions to Handbook 1 have been approved by the Council of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles for immediate implementation." The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints | wasmormon.org
When a Disciplinary Council is Mandatory: Apostasy “As used here, apostasy refers to members who: Are in a same-gender marriage.” Policies on Ordinances for Children of a Parent Living in a Same-Gender Relationship, Updates to Handbook 1, November 3, 2015. "Additions to Handbook 1 have been approved by the Council of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles for immediate implementation." The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
“A natural or adopted child of a parent living in a same-gender relationship, whether the couple is married or cohabiting, may be baptized and confirmed, ordained, or recommended for missionary service only as follows: A mission president or a stake president may request approval from the Office of the First Presidency when ... The child ... specifically disavows the practice of same-gender cohabitation and marriage. The child is of legal age and does not live with a parent who has lived or currently lives in a same-gender cohabitation relationship or marriage.” Policies on Ordinances for Children of a Parent Living in a Same-Gender Relationship, Updates to Handbook 1, November 3, 2015. "Additions to Handbook 1 have been approved by the Council of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles for immediate implementation." The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints | wasmormon.org
“A natural or adopted child of a parent living in a same-gender relationship, whether the couple is married or cohabiting, may be baptized and confirmed, ordained, or recommended for missionary service only as follows: A mission president or a stake president may request approval from the Office of the First Presidency when ... The child ... specifically disavows the practice of same-gender cohabitation and marriage. The child is of legal age and does not live with a parent who has lived or currently lives in a same-gender cohabitation relationship or marriage.” Policies on Ordinances for Children of a Parent Living in a Same-Gender Relationship, Updates to Handbook 1, November 3, 2015. "Additions to Handbook 1 have been approved by the Council of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles for immediate implementation." The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
Children of a Parent Living in a Same-Gender Relationship “A natural or adopted child of a parent living in a same-gender relationship, whether the couple is married or cohabiting, may not receive a name and a blessing.” - Policies on Ordinances for Children of a Parent Living in a Same-Gender Relationship, Updates to Handbook 1, November 3, 2015. "Additions to Handbook 1 have been approved by the Council of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles for immediate implementation." The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints | wasmormon.org
Children of a Parent Living in a Same-Gender Relationship “A natural or adopted child of a parent living in a same-gender relationship, whether the couple is married or cohabiting, may not receive a name and a blessing.” - Policies on Ordinances for Children of a Parent Living in a Same-Gender Relationship, Updates to Handbook 1, November 3, 2015. "Additions to Handbook 1 have been approved by the Council of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles for immediate implementation." The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
“There has never been a Churchwide policy of segregated congregations.” * Footnote: At some periods of time, reflecting local customs and laws, there were instances of segregated congregations in areas such as South Africa and the U.S. South. - Race and the Priesthood - Gospel Topic Essay, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints | wasmormon.org
“There has never been a Churchwide policy of segregated congregations.” * Footnote: At some periods of time, reflecting local customs and laws, there were instances of segregated congregations in areas such as South Africa and the U.S. South. - Race and the Priesthood - Gospel Topic Essay
"I knew from the beginning that I would walk with a spiritual limp the rest of my life, the price I paid for being there, and believing. From this I have learned a truth about Mormonism: The power of its sociology – its cultures, its traditions, its people – is of such intensity and persistent power for those who love it, that doctrine and history can pale in significance unless truth is more important than any other thing. Truth is worth any limp, any price." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"I knew from the beginning that I would walk with a spiritual limp the rest of my life, the price I paid for being there, and believing. From this I have learned a truth about Mormonism: The power of its sociology – its cultures, its traditions, its people – is of such intensity and persistent power for those who love it, that doctrine and history can pale in significance unless truth is more important than any other thing. Truth is worth any limp, any price." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"Who do you blame when you have been duped by a church? I couldn’t blame myself, though the responsibility surely lay there. I wanted to reproach myself for being suckered – but how could I hold responsible the trusting teenager? The trusting college student? If there is no loss as great as the loss of one’s god, there are few tasks to compare with setting out to learn to serve another One. If you’ve been burned by a god, how do you learn to trust another one? Make no mistake about it, I knew I needed what only He could provide: forgiveness of sins, eternal life, church and community based on truth, not beloved fictions." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"Who do you blame when you have been duped by a church? I couldn’t blame myself, though the responsibility surely lay there. I wanted to reproach myself for being suckered – but how could I hold responsible the trusting teenager? The trusting college student? If there is no loss as great as the loss of one’s god, there are few tasks to compare with setting out to learn to serve another One. If you’ve been burned by a god, how do you learn to trust another one? Make no mistake about it, I knew I needed what only He could provide: forgiveness of sins, eternal life, church and community based on truth, not beloved fictions." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"I didn’t want to believe that my own local LDS leadership could be deceptive until I asked to be excommunicated from the LDS Church several months before The Mormon Mirage was to be published. Unbeknownst to me, a Mormon who was a self-appointed mole in ex-Mormon organizations was corresponding with me under the pretext that he had left the Church too and apparently had been reporting my research to Church leaders. The unarticulated and un-targeted sense of betrayal I felt became the permanent inner garment of my soul." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"I didn’t want to believe that my own local LDS leadership could be deceptive until I asked to be excommunicated from the LDS Church several months before The Mormon Mirage was to be published. Unbeknownst to me, a Mormon who was a self-appointed mole in ex-Mormon organizations was corresponding with me under the pretext that he had left the Church too and apparently had been reporting my research to Church leaders. The unarticulated and un-targeted sense of betrayal I felt became the permanent inner garment of my soul." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"But still I wanted to believe the best about Mormons themselves and was genuinely, continuously surprised by their actions as well. I didn’t want to believe that people would lie about an apostate who left for doctrinal reasons, until another woman who left the Church learned that it had been announced in Relief Society meeting that she - who had always been faithful to her husband - was excommunicated for adultery." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"But still I wanted to believe the best about Mormons themselves and was genuinely, continuously surprised by their actions as well. I didn’t want to believe that people would lie about an apostate who left for doctrinal reasons, until another woman who left the Church learned that it had been announced in Relief Society meeting that she - who had always been faithful to her husband - was excommunicated for adultery." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"I was startled over and over by the contrast between what I’d been taught in my BYU classes and what Mormon history really was like—the deceptions of Joseph Smith, the failed prophecies, the ignoble shams. The Book of Mormon continued to crumble before my eyes, unredeemed even by its quaintness and platitudes. The Book of Abraham was an embarrassing fraud. Different god, different heaven, different eternal past. Again and again the glaring difference between Bible doctrine and LDS doctrine disquieted me as if I’d never seen it before." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"I was startled over and over by the contrast between what I’d been taught in my BYU classes and what Mormon history really was like—the deceptions of Joseph Smith, the failed prophecies, the ignoble shams. The Book of Mormon continued to crumble before my eyes, unredeemed even by its quaintness and platitudes. The Book of Abraham was an embarrassing fraud. Different god, different heaven, different eternal past. Again and again the glaring difference between Bible doctrine and LDS doctrine disquieted me as if I’d never seen it before." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"That’s where the true leap of faith was – to believe the Bible was the inviolate communication of this good, relationship-seeking, Creator God. I couldn’t trust anyone or anything else on earth but that Book. But sometimes it was almost too painful to read, and I shrank from His touch. I began “The Mormon Mirage” to explain to myself as much as to anyone why I had made the decision to abandon the single most satisfying and soul-healing thing in my life." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"That’s where the true leap of faith was – to believe the Bible was the inviolate communication of this good, relationship-seeking, Creator God. I couldn’t trust anyone or anything else on earth but that Book. But sometimes it was almost too painful to read, and I shrank from His touch. I began “The Mormon Mirage” to explain to myself as much as to anyone why I had made the decision to abandon the single most satisfying and soul-healing thing in my life." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"I looked around me at the beauty and diversity of nature, and concluded that such order and creativity indicated the existence of a Creator. Whoever made all that was both complicated and good. If He created all of nature, and I was part of nature, He had created me. If He created me and all mankind, I concluded that surely He would want to communicate with us. Since I had seen the danger of unfettered "personal revelation," I supposed that there would have to be a type of communication that would be beyond human contrivances, something truly reliable." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"I looked around me at the beauty and diversity of nature, and concluded that such order and creativity indicated the existence of a Creator. Whoever made all that was both complicated and good. If He created all of nature, and I was part of nature, He had created me. If He created me and all mankind, I concluded that surely He would want to communicate with us. Since I had seen the danger of unfettered "personal revelation," I supposed that there would have to be a type of communication that would be beyond human contrivances, something truly reliable." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"The next fall I went away to BYU, where I was gloriously happy. I studied, believed and lived Mormonism as it wanted to be understood. I honored the prophet and my leaders as personal heroes. I worked hard, putting myself through school without any outside help other than writing scholarships and earned good grades and loved, just loved, being a Mormon. I participated in every ward function and continued to write and be published in BYU’s publications and to read voraciously." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"The next fall I went away to BYU, where I was gloriously happy. I studied, believed and lived Mormonism as it wanted to be understood. I honored the prophet and my leaders as personal heroes. I worked hard, putting myself through school without any outside help other than writing scholarships and earned good grades and loved, just loved, being a Mormon. I participated in every ward function and continued to write and be published in BYU’s publications and to read voraciously." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"I was a convert to the church. I wanted to please God, and I believed that I could do that in Mormonism. No ulterior motives, no grand plan, just simplicity and the literal faith of a child. I had a great respect for Scripture and a love for my Creator, and Mormonism gave me the chance to expand and act on that love while learning more about God and His mysteries than I’d ever dreamed. I was a mormon." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"I was a convert to the church. I wanted to please God, and I believed that I could do that in Mormonism. No ulterior motives, no grand plan, just simplicity and the literal faith of a child. I had a great respect for Scripture and a love for my Creator, and Mormonism gave me the chance to expand and act on that love while learning more about God and His mysteries than I’d ever dreamed. I was a mormon." - Latayne Scott | https://wasmormon.org/profile/latayne-scott/
"Learn to keep your eye on the prophet. He is the Lord’s mouthpiece and the only man who can speak for the Lord today. Let his inspired counsel take precedence. Let his inspired words be a basis for evaluating the counsel of all lesser authorities... This Church is not being directed by the wisdom of men." Teachings of Presidents of the Church: Ezra Taft Benson, Chapter 11: Follow the Prophet | wasmormon.org
"Learn to keep your eye on the prophet. He is the Lord’s mouthpiece and the only man who can speak for the Lord today. Let his inspired counsel take precedence. Let his inspired words be a basis for evaluating the counsel of all lesser authorities... This Church is not being directed by the wisdom of men." Teachings of Presidents of the Church: Ezra Taft Benson, Chapter 11: Follow the Prophet
"When I left, I still more or less “believed”, I just simply didn’t want what was taught. After I left, I gave myself permission to view materials not solely on the church website and have since come to the conclusion that I don’t believe the truth claims of the LDS church. My husband left at the same time as me about 3 years ago, and we’re now trying to survive our 2-year-olds reign of terror." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"When I left, I still more or less “believed”, I just simply didn’t want what was taught. After I left, I gave myself permission to view materials not solely on the church website and have since come to the conclusion that I don’t believe the truth claims of the LDS church. My husband left at the same time as me about 3 years ago, and we’re now trying to survive our 2-year-olds reign of terror." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"It all came to a crossroads when I volunteered to teach a CTR 4 class, and while reading the lesson beforehand I realized I didn’t agree with it. I decided if I can’t agree with a CTR 4 lesson, then this wasn’t what I wanted to raise my future family in." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"It all came to a crossroads when I volunteered to teach a CTR 4 class, and while reading the lesson beforehand I realized I didn’t agree with it. I decided if I can’t agree with a CTR 4 lesson, then this wasn’t what I wanted to raise my future family in." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"As I did my research, I stumbled upon the Gospel Topic Essays and this was when I first learned the extent of Joseph Smith’s polygamy. I brought this up to my mom, and she accused me of trying to get her to read anti-Mormon literature. She didn’t believe that the Gospel Topics Essay I showed her was on the church website were real and questioned how the authors of the essay could know Joseph Smith had more than one wife. I read all the apologist websites and studied scripture and the church website, but the explanations provided were not enough for me." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"As I did my research, I stumbled upon the Gospel Topic Essays and this was when I first learned the extent of Joseph Smith’s polygamy. I brought this up to my mom, and she accused me of trying to get her to read anti-Mormon literature. She didn’t believe that the Gospel Topics Essay I showed her was on the church website were real and questioned how the authors of the essay could know Joseph Smith had more than one wife. I read all the apologist websites and studied scripture and the church website, but the explanations provided were not enough for me." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"My [new] husband and I started considering starting a family, and I knew that I wanted to have a career. I started researching old conference talks, ensign articles, etc to see what the overall consensus was on women working outside the home, and it was obvious to me that while there was discussion of each woman can choose what's best for herself, the overwhelming expectation was to stay home and not work outside the home. I could only find a few quotes that even suggested it might be okay to work and be a mom. This was so hard for me because I knew that I wanted a career and aspirations outside the home, yet that didn’t seem to be the “right” way to be an LDS mom." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"My [new] husband and I started considering starting a family, and I knew that I wanted to have a career. I started researching old conference talks, ensign articles, etc to see what the overall consensus was on women working outside the home, and it was obvious to me that while there was discussion of each woman can choose what's best for herself, the overwhelming expectation was to stay home and not work outside the home. I could only find a few quotes that even suggested it might be okay to work and be a mom. This was so hard for me because I knew that I wanted a career and aspirations outside the home, yet that didn’t seem to be the “right” way to be an LDS mom." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"Bishops as I moved about seemed to barely remember my name. I started working as a police officer, which meant I worked whatever day of the week I was needed. I went to every activity I was off duty for, and often attended sacrament meetings on duty. Yet, I frequently repeated the same conversation that started with “I haven’t seen you in a while, thanks for coming to church today”. After which I would remind them I worked in public service, and they would reply with some sort of “oh that’s right, I forgot”. Maybe they would have treated a man the same way, but it always felt like, as a woman, having a job was bad, but having a "manly" job was almost unforgivable." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"Bishops as I moved about seemed to barely remember my name. I started working as a police officer, which meant I worked whatever day of the week I was needed. I went to every activity I was off duty for, and often attended sacrament meetings on duty. Yet, I frequently repeated the same conversation that started with “I haven’t seen you in a while, thanks for coming to church today”. After which I would remind them I worked in public service, and they would reply with some sort of “oh that’s right, I forgot”. Maybe they would have treated a man the same way, but it always felt like, as a woman, having a job was bad, but having a "manly" job was almost unforgivable." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"While I was deployed, I filed for an annulment of my first marriage, and it was granted shortly after returning home. My ex was also convicted of domestic violence assault during this time against me. I went to the bishop and asked to start the process of having the sealing canceled. He more or less treated me as though I was just too young to have married, and we just “didn’t get along”. I had to retell my story several times because, after each time, the bishop didn’t “remember” any of the incidents of physical violence. The sealing cancellation was eventually granted, but only after requesting my ex-husband's permission." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"While I was deployed, I filed for an annulment of my first marriage, and it was granted shortly after returning home. My ex was also convicted of domestic violence assault during this time against me. I went to the bishop and asked to start the process of having the sealing canceled. He more or less treated me as though I was just too young to have married, and we just “didn’t get along”. I had to retell my story several times because, after each time, the bishop didn’t “remember” any of the incidents of physical violence. The sealing cancellation was eventually granted, but only after requesting my ex-husband's permission." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"I deployed to Afghanistan where the guys I deployed with didn’t treat me well and didn’t comply with the LDS lifestyle standards I expected, yet they were my only source for the priesthood. I was very frustrated because I felt I was living the standards I’d promised, but if I wanted the sacrament or a blessing, I would have to ask one of the men who otherwise treated me horribly to do it for me. Sometimes they would, sometimes they wouldn’t, but I wasn’t allowed to do it for myself." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"I deployed to Afghanistan where the guys I deployed with didn’t treat me well and didn’t comply with the LDS lifestyle standards I expected, yet they were my only source for the priesthood. I was very frustrated because I felt I was living the standards I’d promised, but if I wanted the sacrament or a blessing, I would have to ask one of the men who otherwise treated me horribly to do it for me. Sometimes they would, sometimes they wouldn’t, but I wasn’t allowed to do it for myself." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"My now ex-husband was physically and emotionally abusive and used the words of the temple sealing, and the advice of our sealer, (that I strive to follow my husband’s council) to abuse me, justify his abuse, and manipulate me into staying with him." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"My now ex-husband was physically and emotionally abusive and used the words of the temple sealing, and the advice of our sealer, (that I strive to follow my husband’s council) to abuse me, justify his abuse, and manipulate me into staying with him." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"I grew up very active. I called the young women's president when I was 11 to ask if I could start working on my young womanhood medallion early. I did all the things and checked all the boxes, and honestly felt like my testimony was unbreakable. I even gave a Book of Mormon to my head drill sergeant at Army Basic training. I was a Mormon." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"I grew up very active. I called the young women's president when I was 11 to ask if I could start working on my young womanhood medallion early. I did all the things and checked all the boxes, and honestly felt like my testimony was unbreakable. I even gave a Book of Mormon to my head drill sergeant at Army Basic training. I was a Mormon." - Brooklyn's I Was a Mormon Story | wasmormon.org
"Question: Was Brigham Young a racist? Brigham Young made a number of statements which are now considered blatantly racist" - Fair LDS Apologist Website | Statue of Brigham Young vandalized with red paint and the term 'Racist' | wasmormon.org
"Question: Was Brigham Young a racist? Brigham Young made a number of statements which are now considered blatantly racist" - Fair LDS Apologist Website | Statue of Brigham Young vandalized with red paint and the term 'Racist'
"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." - Brigham Young, LDS Prophet 1863 | wasmormon.org
"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." - Brigham Young, LDS Prophet 1863
"We recognize that same-sex marriages are now legal in the United States and some other countries and that people have the right, if they choose, to enter into those, and we understand that. But that is not a right that exists in the Church." - Apostle D Todd Christofferson, LDS Church, Giving Context for the November Policy of 2015 | wasmormon.org
"We recognize that same-sex marriages are now legal in the United States and some other countries and that people have the right, if they choose, to enter into those, and we understand that. But that is not a right that exists in the Church." - Apostle D Todd Christofferson, LDS Church, Giving Context for the November Policy of 2015
"This prophetic process was followed ... with the recent additions to the Church’s handbook, consequent to the legalization of same-sex marriage in some countries. Filled with compassion for all, and especially for the children, we wrestled at length to understand the Lord’s will in this matter. Ever mindful of God’s plan of salvation and of His hope for eternal life for each of His children, we considered countless permutations and combinations of possible scenarios that could arise. We met repeatedly in the temple in fasting and prayer and sought further direction and inspiration. And then, when the Lord inspired His prophet, President Thomas S. Monson, to declare the mind of the Lord and the will of the Lord, each of us during that sacred moment felt a spiritual confirmation. It was our privilege as Apostles to sustain what had been revealed to President Monson. Revelation from the Lord to His servants is a sacred process." - Elder Russell M Nelson in 2016 regarding the November Policy of 2015 being a Revelation from the Lord | wasmormon.org
"This prophetic process was followed ... with the recent additions to the Church’s handbook, consequent to the legalization of same-sex marriage in some countries. Filled with compassion for all, and especially for the children, we wrestled at length to understand the Lord’s will in this matter. Ever mindful of God’s plan of salvation and of His hope for eternal life for each of His children, we considered countless permutations and combinations of possible scenarios that could arise. We met repeatedly in the temple in fasting and prayer and sought further direction and inspiration. And then, when the Lord inspired His prophet, President Thomas S. Monson, to declare the mind of the Lord and the will of the Lord, each of us during that sacred moment felt a spiritual confirmation. It was our privilege as Apostles to sustain what had been revealed to President Monson. Revelation from the Lord to His servants is a sacred process." - Elder Russell M Nelson in 2016 regarding the November Policy of 2015 being a Revelation from the Lord
"Lyman E. Johnson, the first to be called to the Apostleship when the first Council of Twelve was organized, left the Church, but he never had a really happy day after that. According to President Brigham Young he, (Lyman) on one occasion, said, at a meeting" - Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses | wasmormon.org
"Lyman E. Johnson, the first to be called to the Apostleship when the first Council of Twelve was organized, left the Church, but he never had a really happy day after that. According to President Brigham Young he, (Lyman) on one occasion, said, at a meeting" - Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses