Monthly Archives: November 2023

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“One evening when I was at the factory entrance punching the time clock beginning my 2nd shift work, I encountered Brother P. as he was leaving the building and engaged me in conversation. He asked, "Mike, are you going to go on a Mission?" I said, "No, I am not. I am making preparations to go to University in the Fall, study Aerospace Engineering, enter the Air Force through ROTC and go on to fly jets." Brother P. replied, with a mix of disgust and disappointment, "Well, that's too bad!"” - Mike | https://wasmormon.org/profile/deserveliberty/
“One evening when I was at the factory entrance punching the time clock beginning my 2nd shift work, I encountered Brother P. as he was leaving the building and engaged me in conversation. He asked, "Mike, are you going to go on a Mission?" I said, "No, I am not. I am making preparations to go to University in the Fall, study Aerospace Engineering, enter the Air Force through ROTC and go on to fly jets." Brother P. replied, with a mix of disgust and disappointment, "Well, that's too bad!"” - Mike | https://wasmormon.org/profile/deserveliberty/
"In my youth, before I physically left, I did not develop the personal sovereignty, nor the courage, nor even the idea, to say to my Mormon parent, "I don't believe in this, therefor, I am no longer going to pretend by doing the things I am 'supposed' to do there." Approaching that important male age of 19, I had other plans, going on a Mission did not align with the sense of truth and integrity that I had begun to develop. There was no way that I would participate in preparing for and then inflicting the Mormon sales pitch on fellow human beings. To do so would have been trying to sell them on a view of the universe that I did not believe." - Mike | https://wasmormon.org/profile/deserveliberty/
"In my youth, before I physically left, I did not develop the personal sovereignty, nor the courage, nor even the idea, to say to my Mormon parent, "I don't believe in this, therefor, I am no longer going to pretend by doing the things I am 'supposed' to do there." Approaching that important male age of 19, I had other plans, going on a Mission did not align with the sense of truth and integrity that I had begun to develop. There was no way that I would participate in preparing for and then inflicting the Mormon sales pitch on fellow human beings. To do so would have been trying to sell them on a view of the universe that I did not believe." - Mike | https://wasmormon.org/profile/deserveliberty/
"I left Mormonism at age 19. One might think that my exposure to the cult was therefore very limited, and, yes I am fortunate to have left when I did. However, I left still bearing many scars, wounds, confusions and emotional difficulties that were mostly hidden and not recognized nor understood by me. These things I sorted out over several phases of healing and genuine spiritual discovery throughout life, but not without trouble and tragedy in the interim. My family dynamics certainly contributed to those dysfunctions, but Mormonism acted to cement those dysfunctions and also prevented or greatly impeded other potential moderating or positive mentoring influences that would have otherwise been available from outside my family situation." - Mike | https://wasmormon.org/profile/deserveliberty/
"I left Mormonism at age 19. One might think that my exposure to the cult was therefore very limited, and, yes I am fortunate to have left when I did. However, I left still bearing many scars, wounds, confusions and emotional difficulties that were mostly hidden and not recognized nor understood by me. These things I sorted out over several phases of healing and genuine spiritual discovery throughout life, but not without trouble and tragedy in the interim. My family dynamics certainly contributed to those dysfunctions, but Mormonism acted to cement those dysfunctions and also prevented or greatly impeded other potential moderating or positive mentoring influences that would have otherwise been available from outside my family situation." - Mike | https://wasmormon.org/profile/deserveliberty/
“My father was not a member, not a participant, not interested, generally did not openly express an opinion about how my mother was raising us "in the church," but on occasion said "do what your mother tells you." Per my mother's edict, our attendance and participation was a fundamental requirement of our existence. At "church" to my supposed peers, I was the quiet, skinny little kid who either didn't have a father, or even worse, whose father "wasn't a member!"” - Mike | https://wasmormon.org/profile/deserveliberty/
“My father was not a member, not a participant, not interested, generally did not openly express an opinion about how my mother was raising us "in the church," but on occasion said "do what your mother tells you." Per my mother's edict, our attendance and participation was a fundamental requirement of our existence. At "church" to my supposed peers, I was the quiet, skinny little kid who either didn't have a father, or even worse, whose father "wasn't a member!"” - Mike | https://wasmormon.org/profile/deserveliberty/
"I am a husband, father, teacher, reader, questioner, thinker, traveler and I am living my best life. I was raised in a half-mormon household. This somewhat unique circumstance exacerbated the negative effects of Mormonism upon my psyche, yet may have allowed for an easier departure when that event occurred. I was a Mormon." - Mike | https://wasmormon.org/profile/deserveliberty/
"I am a husband, father, teacher, reader, questioner, thinker, traveler and I am living my best life. I was raised in a half-mormon household. This somewhat unique circumstance exacerbated the negative effects of Mormonism upon my psyche, yet may have allowed for an easier departure when that event occurred. I was a Mormon." - Mike | https://wasmormon.org/profile/deserveliberty/
“[We] have continued to seek the Lord’s guidance and to plead with Him in behalf of His children who were affected by the 2015 policy. We knew that this policy created concern and confusion for some and heartache for others.” - Russell M Nelson, regarding the November Policy Reversal, BYU Devotional, September 2019 | wasmormon.org
“[We] have continued to seek the Lord’s guidance and to plead with Him in behalf of His children who were affected by the 2015 policy. We knew that this policy created concern and confusion for some and heartache for others.” - Russell M Nelson, regarding the November Policy Reversal, BYU Devotional, September 2019
“We of the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve Apostles cannot change the laws of God. We can adjust policy when the Lord directs us to do so. You have recently seen such examples. Because the Restoration is ongoing, policy changes will surely continue.” - Russell M Nelson, regarding the November Policy Reversal, BYU Devotional, September 2019 | wasmormon.org
“We of the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve Apostles cannot change the laws of God. We can adjust policy when the Lord directs us to do so. You have recently seen such examples. Because the Restoration is ongoing, policy changes will surely continue.” - Russell M Nelson, regarding the November Policy Reversal, BYU Devotional, September 2019
“We recently felt directed to adjust the policy such that the baptism of children of LGBT parents may be authorized by bishops without First Presidency approval. We also clarified that homosexual immorality would be treated in the eyes of the Church in the same manner as heterosexual immorality.” - Russell M Nelson, regarding the November Policy Reversal, BYU Devotional, September 2019 | wasmormon.org
“We recently felt directed to adjust the policy such that the baptism of children of LGBT parents may be authorized by bishops without First Presidency approval. We also clarified that homosexual immorality would be treated in the eyes of the Church in the same manner as heterosexual immorality.” - Russell M Nelson, regarding the November Policy Reversal, BYU Devotional, September 2019
“Though it may not have looked this way to some, the 2015 and 2019 policy adjustments on this matter were both motivated by love—the love of our Heavenly Father for His children and the love of the Brethren for those whom we serve. Ask your Heavenly Father if we truly are the Lord’s Apostles and prophets. Ask if we have received revelation on this.” - Russell M Nelson, regarding the November Policy Reversal, BYU Devotional, September 2019 | wasmormon.org
“Though it may not have looked this way to some, the 2015 and 2019 policy adjustments on this matter were both motivated by love—the love of our Heavenly Father for His children and the love of the Brethren for those whom we serve. Ask your Heavenly Father if we truly are the Lord’s Apostles and prophets. Ask if we have received revelation on this.” - Russell M Nelson, regarding the November Policy Reversal, BYU Devotional, September 2019
“These new policies are being sent to priesthood leaders worldwide and will be included in online updates to our Church handbook for leaders. These changes do not represent a shift in Church doctrine related to marriage or the commandments of God in regard to chastity and morality. The doctrine of the plan of salvation and the importance of chastity will not change. These policy changes come after an extended period of counseling with our brethren in the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles and after fervent, united prayer to understand the will of the Lord on these matters.” - Changes to recent Church policies related to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender members. First Presidency Shares Messages from General Conference Leadership Session, April 4, 2019 | wasmormon.org
“These new policies are being sent to priesthood leaders worldwide and will be included in online updates to our Church handbook for leaders. These changes do not represent a shift in Church doctrine related to marriage or the commandments of God in regard to chastity and morality. The doctrine of the plan of salvation and the importance of chastity will not change. These policy changes come after an extended period of counseling with our brethren in the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles and after fervent, united prayer to understand the will of the Lord on these matters.” - Changes to recent Church policies related to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender members. First Presidency Shares Messages from General Conference Leadership Session, April 4, 2019
“Previously, our handbook characterized same-gender marriage by a member as apostasy. While we still consider such a marriage to be a serious transgression, it will not be treated as apostasy for purposes of Church discipline.” - Changes to recent Church policies related to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender members. First Presidency Shares Messages from General Conference Leadership Session, April 4, 2019 | wasmormon.org
“Previously, our handbook characterized same-gender marriage by a member as apostasy. While we still consider such a marriage to be a serious transgression, it will not be treated as apostasy for purposes of Church discipline.” - Changes to recent Church policies related to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender members. First Presidency Shares Messages from General Conference Leadership Session, April 4, 2019
"Effective immediately, children of parents who identify themselves as lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender may be baptized without First Presidency approval if the custodial parents give permission for the baptism and understand both the doctrine that a baptized child will be taught and the covenants he or she will be expected to make.” - Changes to recent Church policies related to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender members. First Presidency Shares Messages from General Conference Leadership Session, April 4, 2019 | wasmormon.org
"Effective immediately, children of parents who identify themselves as lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender may be baptized without First Presidency approval if the custodial parents give permission for the baptism and understand both the doctrine that a baptized child will be taught and the covenants he or she will be expected to make.” - Changes to recent Church policies related to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender members. First Presidency Shares Messages from General Conference Leadership Session, April 4, 2019
"Yesterday's historians and members with questions have been disciplined and excommunicated on accusations that they were "acting in opposition to the church" simply by publishing and discussing the very same information and facts verified today publicly by the church's own essays." - Jeremy Runnells, Author of CES Letter in Letter to his Stake President | wasmormon.org
"Yesterday's historians and members with questions have been disciplined and excommunicated on accusations that they were "acting in opposition to the church" simply by publishing and discussing the very same information and facts verified today publicly by the church's own essays." - Jeremy Runnells, Author of CES Letter in Letter to his Stake President
"Mormon history is discrediting the church. Joseph Smith’s actions and conduct of marrying other men’s wives and 14 year old girls behind Emma’s back is discrediting Joseph Smith. It’s not me that’s discrediting him. Its facts. These are not anti-Mormon lies! It’s amazing to me what was yesterday’s anti-Mormon lies are now today’s Mormon essays!" Jeremy Runnells, Author of CES Letter during his Disciplinary Council | wasmormon.org
"Mormon history is discrediting the church. Joseph Smith’s actions and conduct of marrying other men’s wives and 14 year old girls behind Emma’s back is discrediting Joseph Smith. It’s not me that’s discrediting him. Its facts. These are not anti-Mormon lies! It’s amazing to me what was yesterday’s anti-Mormon lies are now today’s Mormon essays!" Jeremy Runnells, Author of CES Letter during his Disciplinary Council
"Civility and decency seem to have disappeared during this era of polarization and passionate disagreements. Vulgarity, faultfinding, and evil speaking of others are all too common. Too many pundits, politicians, entertainers, and other influencers throw insults constantly. I am greatly concerned that so many people seem to believe that it is completely acceptable to condemn, malign, and vilify anyone who does not agree with them. Many seem eager to damage another’s reputation with pathetic and pithy barbs!" President Russell M. Nelson of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, General Conference April 2023. Giving concern and council he does not follow in the past or in the future. | wasmormon.org
"Civility and decency seem to have disappeared during this era of polarization and passionate disagreements. Vulgarity, faultfinding, and evil speaking of others are all too common. Too many pundits, politicians, entertainers, and other influencers throw insults constantly. I am greatly concerned that so many people seem to believe that it is completely acceptable to condemn, malign, and vilify anyone who does not agree with them. Many seem eager to damage another’s reputation with pathetic and pithy barbs!" President Russell M. Nelson of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, General Conference April 2023. Giving concern and council he does not follow in the past or in the future.
"Civility and decency seem to have disappeared during this era of polarization and passionate disagreements. Vulgarity, faultfinding, and evil speaking of others are all too common. Too many pundits, politicians, entertainers, and other influencers throw insults constantly. I am greatly concerned that so many people seem to believe that it is completely acceptable to condemn, malign, and vilify anyone who does not agree with them. Many seem eager to damage another’s reputation with pathetic and pithy barbs!" President Russell M. Nelson of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, General Conference April 2023. Giving concern and council he does not follow in the past or in the future. | wasmormon.org
"Civility and decency seem to have disappeared during this era of polarization and passionate disagreements. Vulgarity, faultfinding, and evil speaking of others are all too common. Too many pundits, politicians, entertainers, and other influencers throw insults constantly. I am greatly concerned that so many people seem to believe that it is completely acceptable to condemn, malign, and vilify anyone who does not agree with them. Many seem eager to damage another’s reputation with pathetic and pithy barbs!" President Russell M. Nelson of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, General Conference April 2023. Giving concern and council he does not follow in the past or in the future.
“It is clear that the teaching of President Lorenzo Snow [‘As man now is, God once was; as God now is, man may be’] is both acceptable and accepted doctrine in the Church today.” - I Have a Question: Is President Snow’s statement—‘As man now is, God once was; as God now is, man may be’—accepted as official doctrine by the Church? by Gerald Lund, Ensign February 1982, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints | wasmormon.org
“It is clear that the teaching of President Lorenzo Snow [‘As man now is, God once was; as God now is, man may be’] is both acceptable and accepted doctrine in the Church today.” - I Have a Question: Is President Snow’s statement—‘As man now is, God once was; as God now is, man may be’—accepted as official doctrine by the Church? by Gerald Lund, Ensign February 1982, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

Reversing the November Policy

The 2015 November Policy of Exclusion The November Policy of Exclusion, or the LDS Church policy to ban LGBT, was a controversial policy change by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in November 2015. This policy update was initially leaked to the public and was later officially confirmed by the LDS Church. The …

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Is this the teaching of the church today, that God the Father was once a man like we are? Hinckley: "I don’t know that we teach it. I don’t know that we emphasize it. I haven’t heard it discussed for a long time in public discourse. I don’t know. I don’t know all the circumstances under which that statement was made. I understand the philosophical background behind it. But I don’t know a lot about it and I don’t know that others know a lot about it." Gordon B Hinckley interview transcript for TIME Magazine article Kingdom Come of August 1997, in context compared to the printed article. | wasmormon.org
Is this the teaching of the church today, that God the Father was once a man like we are? Hinckley: "I don’t know that we teach it. I don’t know that we emphasize it. I haven’t heard it discussed for a long time in public discourse. I don’t know. I don’t know all the circumstances under which that statement was made. I understand the philosophical background behind it. But I don’t know a lot about it and I don’t know that others know a lot about it." Gordon B Hinckley interview transcript for TIME Magazine article Kingdom Come of August 1997, in context compared to the printed article.
"Never before has the Church had a better reputation than it has now... The media have been kind and generous to us. This past year of pioneer celebrations has resulted in very extensive, favorable press coverage. There have been a few things we wish might have been different. I personally have been much quoted, and in a few instances misquoted and misunderstood. I think that’s to be expected. None of you need worry because you read something that was incompletely reported. You need not worry that I do not understand some matters of doctrine. I think I understand them thoroughly, and it is unfortunate that the reporting may not make this clear. I hope you will never look to the public press as the authority on the doctrines of the Church." - President Gordon B. Hinckley, General Conference, October 1997, immediately following the TIME Magazine article quoting him. | wasmormon.org
"Never before has the Church had a better reputation than it has now...The media have been kind and generous to us. This past year of pioneer celebrations has resulted in very extensive, favorable press coverage. There have been a few things we wish might have been different. I personally have been much quoted, and in a few instances misquoted and misunderstood. I think that’s to be expected. None of you need worry because you read something that was incompletely reported. You need not worry that I do not understand some matters of doctrine. I think I understand them thoroughly, and it is unfortunate that the reporting may not make this clear. I hope you will never look to the public press as the authority on the doctrines of the Church." - President Gordon B. Hinckley, General Conference, October 1997, immediately following the TIME Magazine article quoting him.

As Man Now Is, God Once Was; As Now God Is, Man May Be – Lorenzo Snow

Lorenzo Snow coined a couplet that famously explains a complex doctrine of Mormon theology which is closely tied to the idea of eternal progression. It also gets Mormon theology in deep water with most other Christian denominations. It challenges (or changes) the nature of God and our relationship with him as mankind. It proclaims that …

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On whether his church still holds that God the Father was once a man, he sounded uncertain, "I don't know that we teach it. I don't know that we emphasize it... I understand the philosophical background behind it, but I don't know a lot about it, and I don't think others know a lot about it." - President Gordon B. Hinckley Interview TIME Magazine: Mormons, Inc. August 1997, Kingdom Come Article | wasmormon.org
On whether his church still holds that God the Father was once a man, he sounded uncertain, "I don't know that we teach it. I don't know that we emphasize it... I understand the philosophical background behind it, but I don't know a lot about it, and I don't think others know a lot about it." - President Gordon B. Hinckley Interview TIME Magazine: Mormons, Inc. August 1997, Kingdom Come Article
At first, Hinckley seemed to qualify the idea that men could become gods, suggesting that "it's of course an ideal. It's a hope for a wishful thing," but later affirmed that "yes, of course they can." (He added that women could too, "as companions to their husbands. They can't conceive a king without a queen.") On whether his church still holds that God the Father was once a man, he sounded uncertain, "I don't know that we teach it. I don't know that we emphasize it... I understand the philosophical background behind it, but I don't know a lot about it, and I don't think others know a lot about it." - President Gordon B. Hinckley Interview TIME Magazine: Mormons, Inc. August 1997, Kingdom Come Article | wasmormon.org
At first, Hinckley seemed to qualify the idea that men could become gods, suggesting that "it's of course an ideal. It's a hope for a wishful thing," but later affirmed that "yes, of course they can." (He added that women could too, "as companions to their husbands. They can't conceive a king without a queen.") On whether his church still holds that God the Father was once a man, he sounded uncertain, "I don't know that we teach it. I don't know that we emphasize it... I understand the philosophical background behind it, but I don't know a lot about it, and I don't think others know a lot about it." - President Gordon B. Hinckley Interview TIME Magazine: Mormons, Inc. August 1997, Kingdom Come Article